Exclusive - Charles Krauthammer Extended Interview Pt. 2

  • Aired:  10/23/13
  •  | Views: 129,396

In this exclusive, unedited interview, "Things That Matter" author Charles Krauthammer questions the Tea Party's interpretation of the Constitution. (8:33)

WE'RE BACK DISCUSSING CHARLESKRAUTHAMMER'S BOOK "THINGS THAT

MATTER."

THE THING THAT HAPPENS ON THISPROGRAM ALL THE

TIME IS PEOPLE COME ON ANDTALK ABOUT THE REASONABLE NATURE

OF THEIR POSITIONS, BUT THETACTICS

NEVER MATCH IT.

WE HAD A REPUBLICAN HOUSE OFREPRESENTATIVES OSTENSIBLY

UNDER THE GUISE OF PROTECTINGTHE ECONOMY SHUT DOWN THE

GOVERNMENT COSTING US $24BILLION AND IN ESSENCE DOING A

TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF DAMAGE.

WHEN YOU SPEAK LIKE THIS AND YOUSAY, WELL, THEY -- THE REAL

THOUGHT BEHIND ALL THIS IS QUITEREASONABLE, WE DON'T GET TO SEE

ANY EVIDENCE OF THAT.

>> THAT'S WHY YOU NEED THE BOOK.

[ LAUGHTER ]LET ME EXPLAIN TO YOU.

>> Jon: YEAH.

>> THERE ARE DIVISIONS WITHINCONSERVATIVES AND I THINK

THERE'S A LARGE ELEMENT OF ITWHICH YOU ARE MISSING.

I DON'T THINK IT'S DELIBERATETHAT THE OTHER SIDE THE MORE

RADICAL ELEMENTS ARE THE LOUDERRAONES. IF YOU'D WATCH ME, ANDR

AGAINYOU DON'T WATCH ENOUGH FOX.

IF YOU WATCHED OVER THE LASTMONTH I'M OPPOSED TO THE TACTICS

OF THOSE WHO SHUT DOWN THEGOVERNMENT.

THAT IT WOULD NOT WORK, IT WASUNNECESSARY AND THERE WAS NO WAY

THAT UNDER OUR CONSTITUTIONALSTRUCTURE THAT YOU CAN UNDO

OBAMACARE THE LAW OF THE LANDFROM A HOUSE OF CONGRESS.

THE THING THAT DEFINES THE TEATHE THIPARTY IS A KIND OFE TEA

CONSTITUTIONALSPIRIT AT ITS BEST.

IT AROSE AS A REACTION TO WHATIT SAW AS THE EXCESSES OF OBAMA,

THE TRILLION DOLLAR STIMULUS ANDTTHE TAKEOVER OF A SIXTH OF THED

AMERICAN ECONOMY, AND IT GROWSWITHOUT LEADERS OR WITHOUT ANY

KIND OF ALTERIORMOTIVE.

I THINK IT SAW -- IT DIDN'T --THE ONE THING IT DIDN'T DO --

AND THIS IS WHERE I CRITICIZEDIT -- IT WANTED TO SEE A RETURN

TO LIMITED GOVERNMENT.

I WOULD ARGUE AGAINST THEM AS IDID ON THE AIR BUT ALSO A

CHAPTER IN THE BOOK ON THIS.

IF YOU ARE TRULY CONSTITUTIONALIN THAT SENSE THEN YOU HAVE TO

RESPECT THE MADISONIAN STRUCTUREWHICH HAS

A DIVISION OF POWER, THE ESSENCEOF OUR DEMOCRACY AND THE REASON

WE'VE SUCCEED FOR TWO CENTURIES.

YOU DIVIDE POWER AND YOU CANNOTGOVERN AS A MINORITY PARTY.

YOU CAN BE A BLOCKER.

YOU CAN CAUSE GRIDLOCK IN THEMADISONIAN STRUCTURE.

IT'S INTENDED TO PREVENTTYRANNY.

YOU CAN'T GOVERN IF YOU ARE A

MINORITY AND THAT IS THE ESSENCEOF WHAT WAS DONE WRONG HERE.

>> LET ME PAINT A DIFFERENTNARRATIVE OF THAT.

SURPRISE ME.

[LAUGHTER]RATHER THAN A SPONTANEOUS

GRASSROOTS REVOLUTION BASED ONTHE EXCESSES OF OBAMA AND HIS

TRILLION DOLLAR DEFICIT, I SEEIT AS THE NATURAL PROGRESSION OF

REPUBLICAN RHETORIC IN POLITICSOVER 40 YEARS WHICH IS PLAY UPON

CONSERVATIVE ANGER,ENRAGE THEM, RIDE THAT

ENERGY BUT DON'T ALLOW THEM TOBE IN THE GOVERNING POSITION.

STILL MAINTAIN A CERTAINCONSERVATIVE ELITE POWER

STRUCTURE THAT HARNESSES THEIRANGER.

KARL ROVE WAS VERY SPECIFIC INTHE 2004 ELECTORAL PLAN, WE'RE

GOING TO FIND THEIR ANGER POINTS WE WE'RE GOING TO SQUEEZE THEM.

I DON'T THINK THEY WERERESPONDING TO OBAMA.

HE WASN'T THERE LONG ENOUGH FORIT TO HAPPEN.

IT WAS DAY ONE.

THEY WERE RESPONDING TOMEDICARE PLAN D,

COMPASSIONATE CONSERVATISM, ANDWHAT THEY WERE RESPONDING TO WAS

THE SEEDS OFANGER THAT KARL ROVEAND MANY OF THOSE, ATWATER ANDALL

THOSE GUYS HAVE SEWN AND RIDDENTHE SOUTHERN STRATEGY FOR YEARS

AND YEARS. AND NOW THE BEASTTHEY MADE IN THE LAB WANTS TO

CONTROL AND HAVE POWER AND THATIS WHERE THIS BATTLE IS.

>> IT'S AN EXCELLENT ELABORATIONBUT UNFORTUNATELY IT'S WRONG.

>> Jon: WHAT?

WHAT?

[LAUGHTER]I THINK THERE'S A COMMON GROUND

BETWEEN BOTH NARRATIVES THAT CANBE SHOWN HERE.

>> YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT THEPOLITICS OF IT.

ON YOUR SIDE ALAN GRAYSON'S WHOPUT OUT AN AD WITH AN EMAIL WITH

TEA PARTY WITH A T AS A FLAMINGHCROSS.

>> Jon: HE'S ONE DUDE.

>> YOU ARE SWEPT UP.

THIS IS A DIFFERENT KIND OFPOLITICAL CULTURE.

IT'S RAPID.

WE HAVE THE SOCIAL MEDIA.

A LOT OF STUFF EMERGES IN THEBLOGO SPHERE THAT WON'T HAVE

EMERGED LONG AGO.

I THINK YOU ARE LOOKING TOO MUCHAT THE EXTREMES THAT EXPRESS

THEM SELF-THE FUNDAMENTAL ISSUE IS SIMPLE.

GIVE ME 30 SECONDS.

>> Jon: OKAY.

>> CAN YOU HANG ON?

>> Jon: I CAN.

>> IN THAT CASE GIVE ME AMINUTE.

>> Jon: I CAN'T HANG ON THATLONG.

I HAVE TO TALK BEFORE THEN.

>> WE'RE NEGOTIATING.

>> Jon: 45 SECONDS GO.

>> HERE IT IS.

WE HAVE THE WELFARE STATE WHICHHAS BEEN A SUCCESS.

IT'S A CRISIS POINT WHERE IT HASTO DECIDE WHICH WAY IT'S GOING

TO GO.

THERE'S A REASONABLE ARGUMENT ONYOUR SIDE WITH ONE OF THE THINGS

PEOPLE WANT IS ACCESS TO MEDICALCARE.

THE FUNDAMENTAL ARGUMENT IS NOTANGER OR RESENTMENT IT'S THAT

WE'RE AT THE LIMITS.

WE HAVE $17 TRILLION IN DEBT.

WE'RE NOT AT THE POINT TO ADD ANEW ENTITLEMENT, THE COUNTRY

CANNOT SUSTAIN IT AND IT WILLRUIN ALL THE ADVANCES THAT WE

HAVE MADE IF YOU DESTROY ANECONOMY, YOU ARE LEFT WITH

NOTHING.

AND THEY ARE SAYING -- AND THISIS AGAIN THE BEST ARGUMENT, THE

MOST HONORABLE ONE.

I GRANT YOUR SIDE THE MOSTHONORABLE EXPOSITION.

YOU OUGHT TO GRANT THE OTHERSIDE.

I THINK IT'S A GREAT ARGUMENT.

I WELCOME IT AND I THINK IT'SWHAT THE COUNTRY OUGHT TO BE

DISCUSSING.

DO YOU WANT TO DISCUSS AGRAYSON ON YOUR SIDE OR LOONEY

ON MY SIDE, OKAY BUT THAT'S ADISTRACTION.

THE QUESTION IS WHICH WAY DOESTHE WELFARE STATE GO.

>> Jon: UNDERSTANDABLE.

LET ME ADDRESS THAT IF YOU'VEGOT -- GIVE ME TWO AND A HALF

MINUTES.

>> I'VE ALREADY LOST.

>> Jon: YOU ARE PAINTING ASITUATION THAT I AM CHERRY

PICKING SOME LUNATIC FRINGEOF THE RIGHT.

ALAN GRAYSON DIDN'T TRY TOSHUTDOWN THE GOVERNMENT.

THIS IS A MOVEMENT AMONGST THERIGHT THAT IS NOT ON THE FRINGE

THAT LACKS POWER.

THIS IS THE CONTROLLING ETHOS.

THERE ARE MODERATE REPUBLICANSAS YOU SPEAK OF THAT HAVE A MORE

CONSERVATIVE ETHOS, DO ACCEPT A

CERTAIN STATUS QUO OF THELIBERAL SOCIAL SAFETY NET BUT

THEY ARE NOT THE ONESCONTROLLING THE ETHOS.

THEY ARE THE ONES WHO FEAR BEINGPRIMARIED ON THE RIGHT BY ALL

THE MONEY COMING IN.

THEY'VE ORGANIZED THISGOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN THIS IDEA

THAT THE DEBT CEILING APOLITICAL FOOTBALL AND BEYOND

THAT, THIS IDEA THAT THE WELFARESTATE IS AT A CRISIS POINT.

WE HAVE TO DECIDE, THE TAX BITEIS THE LOWEST ON INCOME SINCE

1961 BUT THERE'S A REFUSAL TOBUDGE ON ANY LOOPHOLES OF ANY

NEW TAXES AND ANY NEW REVENUE.

IT'S FOOLHARDY TO SAY IT'S ANEQUIVALENT ARGUMENT BETWEEN THE

FRINGE ON THE LEFT AND THEFRINGE ON THE RIGHT.

THERE'S A GROUP OF PEOPLE THATHAVE ACCEPTED THE STATUS QUO

CONSENSUS THAN THERE IS A LARGEGROUP OF NIHILISTS SLOWLY

CONSUMING AND CONTROLLING THEREPUBLICAN PARTY NOT ALLOWING

THE CONVERSATION TO OCCUR ANDUSING THEIR CHAOS DELEGITIMIZE

ALL GOVERNMENT PROGRAMS.

>> CONTROLLING THE REPUBLICANPARTY.

I THINK PERHAPS THAT IS ALIBERAL WISH.

>> DID JOHN BOEHNER NOT SAY IDIDN'T WANT TO DO THIS BUT I HAD

TO FOLLOW MY CAUCUS?

>> WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUTHERE AND MAKING IT INTO A COSMIC

IDEA LOGICAL STRUCTURE.

>> Jon: I SMOKE A LOT OF DOPE.

IT'S THE ONLY WAY I CAN TALKE.

THIS COSMICALLY.

WERE YOU IN COLORADO?

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