October 6, 2010 - Philip Dray

  • Episode: 15128
  • (0)

Aasif Mandvi visits a divided Delaware, and Philip Dray remembers America's labor movement.

>> Jon: WELCOME TO "THE DAILY

SHOW."

MY NAME IS JON STEWART.

AUTHOR PHILIP DRAY IS ON THE

SHOW TONIGHT.

HERE TO TALK ABOUT HIS NEW BOOK

"THERE IS POWER IN A UNION."

IT'S ABOUT THE LABOR UNION IN

THE AMERICA.

HOPEFULLY WE'RE FINISHED BY

11:27 OR WE PAY HIM TIME AND A

HALF.

I HAD THE GREAT ET CETERA

QUESTION I'VE EVER HAD IN THE

AUDIENCE TODAY.

A GENTLEMAN STOOD UP VERY

QUIETLY AND SAID, "WHAT TIME

WERE YOU BORN?"

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

NOW, I DON'T KNOW IF YOUR

MOTHER'S VAGINA HAD A CLOCK IN

IT...

[LAUGHTER]

BUT I WAS BORN IN THE EARLY

'60s.

BACK THEN IT WAS JUST SUNDIALS.

HOW THE HELL SHOULD I KNOW?

LET'S BEGIN TONIGHT WITH OUR

CONTINUING COVERAGE OF

INDECISION 2010, MID-TERM

MADNESS.

IT SEEMS INEVITABLE THAT

REPUBLICANS IN THIS SEASON OF

VOTER ANGER AND CHANGE WILL

CLAIM THE HOUSE OF

REPRESENTATIVES.

BUT WHAT OF THE SENATE, THE

WORLD'S MOST DELIBERATIVE BODY,

THE SAUCER THAT COOLS THE

HOUSE'S HOT TEA AND, OF COURSE,

KILLS MOST OF ITS LEGISLATION?

COULD THE DEMOCRATS ALSO LOSE

THE SENATE AS WELL AS THE

UNDERGROUND SECRET THIRD HOUSE

OF CONGRESS, WHERE... WHOOPS.

[LAUGHTER]

I'VE SAID TOO MUCH.

SO HOW BAD IS IT FOR THE DEMS IN

THE SENATE?

>> THE MAGIC NUMBER IS TEN.

>> THERE ARE NO REPUBLICAN

SENATE SEATS REALLY IN DANGER,

BUT THERE ARE 13 DEMOCRATIC

SEATS IN DANGER.

>> Jon: 13 DEMOCRATIC SEATS

ARE IN DANGER.

SO THAT'S WHAT LASSIE WAS TRYING

TO TELL ME.

[LAUGHTER]

WOOF, WOOF, WOOF.

TROUBLE FOR THE DEMOCRATS AT THE

OLD MILL?

SHOULDN'T LASSIE BE...

[LAUGHTER]

WE ADDED THAT PICTURE AFTER

REHEARSAL, AND I DIDN'T REALIZE

IT WAS ONE OF THOSE, OH, SHOULD

HAVE.

[LAUGHTER]

WELL... SO HOW MUCH TROUBLE ARE

THE DEMOCRATS IN?

EVEN SENATE MAJORITY LEADER

HARRY REID, THAT EXCITING AND

CHARISMATIC LEADER, IS FACING A

TOUGH CHALLENGE FOR HIS SEAT IN

NEVADA.

>> REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE FOR U.S.

SENATE SHARRON ANGLE.

>> SHE SUGGESTED ENTITLEMENT

PROGRAMS HAVE SPOILED OUR

CITIZENRY.

>> SHE SAYS GAY AMERICANS SHOULD

NOT BE ALLOWED TO BE CHILDREN.

>> IT MAY BE PART OF GOD'S PLAN

IF RAPE VICTIMS GET PREGNANT.

>> SHE DOES NOT BELIEVE BELIEVE

IN SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND

STATE.

>> SHE'S ADVOCATED WITHDRAWING

FROM THE UNITED NATIONS,

ABOLISHING THE E.P.A. AND MUCH

OF THE TAX CODE.

>> Jon: SHE WANTS TO ABOLISH

THE DEPARTMENT OF WEIGHTS AND

MEASURES.

FROM NOW ON JUST DO BUSINESS

LIKE THIS.

[LAUGHTER]

SHE WANTS TO DISSOLVE THE POST

OFFICE AND SEND ALL HER MESSAGES

THROUGH ANGELS.

THEY'RE EVERYWHERE.

[LAUGHTER]

SO HERE'S THE THING: REID IS

TIED WITH HER.

WHICH CAN ONLY MEAN ONE THING,

NEVADAIANS MUST REALLY HATE THE

E.P.A. OR HARRY REID.

SO IF REPUBLICANS REGAIN THE

SENATE, WHO COULD BE THE NEW

MAJORITY LEADER?

JIM DeMINT WOULD THEN BE

COUNTED ON TO REIN IN

IDEOLOGICAL MUSTANGS LIKE ANGLE.

>> HE'S TAKING A LOT OF HEAT FOR

SOME COMMENTS HE MADE ABOUT GAYS

AND UNWED MOTHERS.

HE SAID ON SATURDAY THAT THEY

SHOULD BE BANNED FROM TEACHING.

>> Jon: OH, MY GOD, DID JIM

DeMINT JUST OUTLAW GLEE CLUBS?

[LAUGHTER]

NOT TO BE RUDE TO SOUTH

CAROLINA, BUT IF YOU RULE OUT

GAYS AND UNWED MOTHERS FROM

TEACHING YOU DOWN THERE, YOU'RE

REALLY ONLY LEFT WITH CREEPY

OUT-OF-TOUCH BASEMENT DWELLERS

WHO SEEM A LITTLE OFF, YOU KNOW,

DeMINT'S OPPONENT.

[LAUGHTER]

40 POINTS BEHIND.

IN THIS CLIMATE, IS THERE ANY

EXTREME A REPUBLICAN CAN GO TO

THAT WILL HURT THEIR CHANCES IN

NOVEMBER?

>> I'M NOT A WITCH.

[LAUGHTER]

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

>> Jon: I KNOW THIS GAME.

I KNOW THIS GAME.

I AM NOT A CENATUR.

YOUR TURN.

>> I'M IN THE A WITCH.

I'M NOTHING YOU'VE HEARD.

I'M YOU.

[LAUGHTER]

>> Jon: YOU'RE ME?

BECAUSE I DON'T RECALL THE LAST

TIME I HAD TO DENY I WAS A

WITCH.

[LAUGHTER]

THAT'S CHRISTIE O'DONNELL, THE

REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE FOR SENATOR

IN DELAWARE.

SHE'S CURRENTLY ABOUT 16 POINTS

DOWN IN THE POLLS, PROBABLY

BECAUSE SHE EXHIBITS THE TYPE OF

JUDGMENT THAT HAS HER DENYING

SHE IS A WITCH WHILE STANDING IN

FRONT OF WHAT APPEARS TO BE

STEAM FROM A BUBBLING CAULDRON.

[LAUGHTER]

HEY, WHERE WE GOING TO SHOOT

CHRISTINE O'DONNELL'S COMMERCIAL

WHERE SHE DENIES A WITCH?

HEY, ELVIRA'S SET IS AVAILABLE.

[LAUGHTER]

IT'S A ME -- PECULIAR ELECTION

SEASON WHERE ONCE AGAIN

AMERICANS ARE BEING TOLD JUST

HOW DIVIDED WE ARE FROM A

NATION, AND HOW WAS MUST PICK

FROM ONE OF TWO DOCTRINE

CHOICES.

ASHJIAN EXPLORES THE O'DONNELL

RACE WHICH EPITOMIZES THE

CONFLICT.

>> MORE THAN ANY STATE DELAWARE

HAS BECOME A MICROCOSM OF THE

WAY WE ARE POLITICALLY.

>> CHRISTINE O'DONNELL, IS SHE A

WITCH?

>> DEMOCRATS ARE COMING OUT OF

THE WOODWORK TO SUPPORT

DELAWARE'S MARXIST.

>> SHE ONCE SAID SHE DABBLED IN

WITCHCRAFT.

>> HOW DID WE REACH A POINT

WHERE EVERYTHING IS REDUCED TO A

POLITICAL CARICATURE?

IN DELAWARE, IT'S ALWAYS BEEN

THAT WAY, ACCORDING TO

UNIVERSITY PROFESSOR JASON

MIKEOFF.

>> CHRISTINE O'DONNELL WON THE

REPUBLICAN PRIMARY PRIMARILY

BECAUSE OF THE SOUTH.

VOTERS IN THE SOUTH ARE MUCH

MORE CONSERVATIVE, AGRARIAN.

THEY TEND TO BE MORE RELIGIOUS.

THEY TEND TO BE WHITE.

>> THE SOUTH.

YOU MEAN PEOPLE COMING UP FROM

GEORGIA AND SOUTH CAROLINA TO

VOTE?

>> NO, THE SOUTH IS DELAWARE.

>> WHEN YOU SAY THERE'S A SOUTH

IN DELAWARE...

>> YEAH?

>> DELAWARE?

>> DELAWARE.

>> IS IT REALLY CALLED SOUTH, OR

IS IT JUST CALLED LIKE OVER

THERE?

WAS THE NORTH REALLY FILLED WITH

MONEYED LIBERAL ELITISTS AND THE

SOUTH WITH GOD-FEARING PATRIOTS?

I'D SOMEHOW HAVE TO TRAVEL THE

LENGTH OF THE STATE AND... WHOA,

WHOA, WHOA, TOO FAR.

LOOP BACK AROUND.

YEAH, THERE YOU GO.

>> WE HAVE THE UNIVERSITY, AND

WE HAVE BIG INDUSTRIAL PLACES.

>> WHAT DO YOU THINK OF PEOPLE

FROM DOWN SOUTH?

>> I THINK OF THE SOUTH, I THINK

OF HILLBILLY, REDNECK, IF YOU

WILL.

>> AND WHAT ARE YOU?

>> I CONSIDER MYSELF A CIVILIZED

HUMAN BEING.

>> REALLY?

>> YEAH.

>> WAS SOUTHERN DELAWARE REALLY

SUCH A BACKWATER?

THERE WAS ONLY ONE WAY TO FIND

OUT, SO I HEADED DOWN TO DIXIE

TO --

>> YOU'VE ARRIVED AT YOUR

DESTINATION.

>> ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

WE JUST WENT LIKE FIVE FEET.

>> OUR VALUES ARE DEFINITELY

MORE CONSERVATIVE THAN THEY ARE

UP NORTH.

>> THEY DON'T LIKE NORTHERNERS

DOWN HERE DOWN HERE SO MUCH.

>> NO?

>> NO, NO, THEY THINK THEY'RE

INVADING THEIR SACRED LAND DOWN

HERE.

>> IT'S ONLY 40 MINUTES AWAY,

BUT YOU'D THINK YOU WENT TO

ARKANSAS OR ALABAMA.

>> IT'S A DIFFERENT BREED OF

PEOPLE UP THERE.

>> DOWN SOUTH THEY DON'T HAVE

UNIVERSITIES OR THEATERS OR

PLAYHOUSES.

>> NO, THEY DON'T.

WHILE THE SOUTH HAS ONLY TWO

MUSEUMS AND A SATELLITE CAMPUS

OF THE UNIVERSITY OF DELAWARE,

THE NORTH BOASTS THREE MUSEUMS

AND THE MAIN CAMPUS OF THE

UNIVERSITY OF DELAWARE.

IT'S AS IF THEY'RE TWO

COMPLETELY SEPARATE STATES.

>> DOWN HERE WE GO TO THE FLEA

MARKETS.

>> WHAT DO THEY DO?

>> THEY GO TO THE FLEA MALLS.

>> THE FLEA MALLS?

>> THE FLEA MALLS.

>> DOWN HERE IT'S THE FLEA

MARKET.

>> THE FLEA MARKET.

>> AND AS I DISCOVERED, THAT'S

NOT THE ONLY RADICAL DIFFERENCE.

I'M GOING TO GET A CHEF SALAD.

>> OKAY.

>> WHAT DO YOU CALL A

CHEESESTEAK DOWN HERE?

>> CHEESESTEAK.

>> OH, YOU CALL IT WHAT?

>> CHEESESTEAK.

>> A CHEESESTEAK?

BECAUSE UP NORTH THEY CALL IT A

CHEESESTEAK.

>> OH.

OKAY.

WE CALL IT A CHEESESTEAK.

>> A CHEESESTEAK.

A CHEESESTEAK.

>> YES.

>> BECAUSE WE CALL IT A

CHEESESTEAK.

WE DON'T CALL IT A CHEEEEZ

STEAK.

WE CALL IT A CHEESE STEAK.

>> WHAT DO YOU CALL IT?

>> CHEEESE STEAK.

>> WE CALL IT A CHEESESTEAK.

>> OKAY.

>> CLEARLY THE BATTLELINES IN

THE STATE OF DELAWARE HAVE BEEN

DRAWN, YET AS OFTEN THE CASE,

THE PEOPLE WHO SUFFER THE MOST

AREN'T THOSE IN THE NORTH OR THE

SOUTH, BUT THOSE ON THE BORDER.

>> I TRY NOT TO, YOU KNOW, GET

IN THE BATTLE OF NORTH AND

SOUTH, BUT I GOT SOME FAMILY

THAT LIVES UP NORTH HERE, AND

IT'S A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT PACE

DOWN HERE.

>> YOU LIVE ON THE BORDER, BUT

IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU KIND OF

IDENTIFY WITH THE SOUTH?

>> YEAH, YEAH, I WOULD SAY SO.

>> LOOKING AT YOU, YOU LOOK LIKE

YOU COULD BE REDNECK, BE A

REDNECK, AND IF YOU STAND OVER

HERE, NOW YOU'RE A DOUCHEBAG

HIPSTER.

SEE WHAT I'M SAYING?

>> FROM THE NORTH.

>> FROM THE NORTH, RIGHT?

IT'S UNCLEAR IF EITHER CANDIDATE

CAN UNITE THIS WAR-TORN STATE,

AND CERTAINLY THERE'S ONE THING

THAT WILL NEVER BE RESOLVED.

A CHEESE STEAK?

>> YEAH.

>> SO YOU DON'T CALL IT A

CHEESESTEAK?

>> IT'S A CHEESESTEAK.

>> YOU CALL IT A CHEESESTEAK?

>> YES.

>> BECAUSE WE CALL IT A CHEESE

STEAK.

[CHEERS AND APPLAUSE]

REGULAR VIEWERS OF THIS PROGRAM

ARE AWARE THAT WE ARE PLANNING

SOMEWHAT OF A GET-TOGETHER, A

RALLY TO RESTORE SANITY ON

OCTOBER 30th IN THE YEAR OF

OUR LORD 2010 IN WASHINGTON,

D.C.

BUT THE QUESTION THEN BECOMES

WHERE EXACTLY IN WASHINGTON,

D.C.

D.CAN K. IS A RATHER LARGE AND

QUITE FRANKLY POORLY DESIGNED

CITY.

[LAUGHTER]

SERIOUSLY, FOUR UNCONNECTED

EIGHTH STREETS?

IT'S LIKE A NEW YORK AVENUE THAT

FOR SOME REASON JUST TURNS INTO

CONNECTICUT AVENUE FOR NO

APPARENT REASON.

I MEAN, THE WHOLE THING IS...

I'M SURPRISE GRAVITY WORKS DOWN

THERE SOMETIMES.

ANYWAY, WE BELIEVE WE FINALLY

FOUND A SPACE ON THE NATIONAL

MALL THAT SEEMS USEFUL,

SUCCESSFUL AND AT THE SAME TIME

SYNONYMOUS WITH NOTHING ELSE

THAT'S EVER BEEN DONE.

IT'S NOT THE LINCOLN MEMORIAL

WHERE THE HISTORIC MARTIN LUTHER

KING SPOKE OR THE HIS STAIRIC

GLENN BECK SPOKE OR WHERE FOREST

FOUND JENNY.

OH, FOREST.

HE DOESN'T KNOW IT YET, BUT

BECAUSE SHE'S A HIPPIE, GOD

KILLS HER.

[LAUGHTER]

HE DOESN'T KNOW IT YET.

IT'S NOT THE STEPS OF THE

CAPITOL BUILDING WHERE THE

MILLION MAN MARCH WAS HELD OR

THE WASHINGTON MONUMENT WHERE

GIANT BIZARRE ROW AND GIANT

SUPERMAN ONCE DUALED FOR

SUPREMACY.

WE WILL RALLY HERE, RIGHT HERE,

THE EAST END OF THE NATIONAL

MALL BETWEEN THIRD STREET AND

SEVENTH STREET.

AS YOU CAN SEE, THERE'S THE

WASHINGTON MONUMENT.

THERE'S THE REFLECTING POOL.

THERE'S THE LINCOLN MEMORIAL.

WE'RE IN THE BACK OF ALL THAT.

AS FAR AS WE KNOW, NO HUGE,

ICONIC EVENT HAS EVER TAKEN

PLACE THERE, AND IT'S FAR ENOUGH

AWAY FROM GROUND ZERO, 206

MILES, FOR US TO HAVE ASH AT THE

EVENT.

THAT'S RIGHT.

AS LONG AS HE STAYS ON THE

SOUTHRENMOST PART OF THE STAGE.

SO JOIN US THERE.

AND WHILE YOU'RE PLANNING A

TRIP, CONTRIBUTE TO THE RALLY'S

DESIGNATED CHARITY, THE TRUST

FOR THE NATIONAL MALL.

YOU CAN DO IT BY CLICKING ON

DONATE AT RALLYFORSANITY.COM OR

GO TO NATIONALMALL.ORG AND CLICK

ON CONTRIBUTE.

THE NATIONAL MALL IS AN

INCREDIBLE MONUMENT FOR ALL

AMERICANS.

IT'S IN DESPERATE NEED FOR

REPAIR, ESPECIALLY AFTER ALL OF

US RALLY ON IT.

IT'S THE REASONABLE THING TO DO.

GET READY TO RALLY, AND

REMEMBER, THIS IS THE PEOPLE'S

PLACE, SO TREAT THE MALL WITH

RESPECT, WHICH MEANS DON'T TAKE

ANY PICTURES OF YOURSELVES

PRETENDING THE WASHINGTON

MONUMENT IS YOUR PENIS.

[APPLAUSE]

[LAUGHTER]

>> Jon: WELCOME BACK.

MY GUEST TONIGHT, AN AUTHOR

WHOSE NEW BOOK IS CALLED "THERE

IS POWER IN A UNION: THE EPIC

STORY OF LABOR IN AMERICA."

PLEASE WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM

PHILIP DRAY.

[APPLAUSE]

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Jon: THERE IS POWER IN A

UNION.

HAVE WE IN THIS COUNTRY, DO YOU

THINK, HAVE WE FORGOTTEN THE

STORY OF LABOR IN THIS COUNTRY?

HAVE WE FORGOTTEN THE STRUGGLE

THAT PEOPLE WENT THROUGH AT THE

TURN OF THE CENTURY, LAST

CENTURY?

>> I THINK TO A GREAT EXTENT WE

HAVE.

THAT'S REALLY WHAT PROMPTED ME

TO WRITE THE BOOK BECAUSE I FELT

THAT THIS MOVEMENT, WHICH OUR

GRANDPARENTS AND GREAT

GRANDPARENTS WERE SO INVOLVED IN

AND THAT ACCOMPLISHED SO MUCH, A

LOT OF THE STANDARDS OF

WORKPLACE SAFETY AND HOURS AND

CONDITIONS WE TAKE FOR GRANTED,

THAT STORY HAD LARGELY BEEN

FORGOTTEN.

IT'S A GREAT STORY OF A SOCIAL

MOVEMENT.

AND I THOUGHT IT WAS WORTH

REMEMBERING.

>> Jon: IT IS, YOU KNOW, THE

VIOLENCE THAT CAME ALONG WITH

FIGHTING TO NOT HAVE TO WORK IN

A MINE FOR THE HOURS THAT THEY

HAD TO OR NOT HAVE TO SHOP AT A

COMPANY STORE.

HOW WERE THE WORKERS ABLE TO

WITHSTAND THE KINDS OF ASSAULTS

THAT WERE ON THEM?

>> WELL, IT WAS... YOU'RE RIGHT,

IT WAS VERY VIOLENT,

PARTICULARLY IN THE 19th

CENTURY.

THE WORKERS REALLY HAD... THE

GOVERNMENT TOOK HANDS-OFF

ATTITUDE UNTIL THEY STARTED

SENDING IN FEDERAL SOLDIERS, AND

WORKERS WERE OFTEN PUT DOWN

VIOLENTLY.

YOU KNOW, THE ARMORY BUILDINGS

WE SEE IN OUR BIG CITIES TODAY,

MOST OF THEM WERE PUT THERE SO

TROOPS WOULD BE ABLE TO GATHER

NEAR PLACES OF WORK.

>> Jon: THE STEEL STRIKE IN

PARTICULAR, THE PINKERTON FELLAS

WENT IN.

>> THE HOMESTEAD STRIKE OF 1892,

VERY VIOLENT.

WHAT WOULD HAPPEN, YOU CAN

IMAGINE THE NATION WOULD BE

OUTRAGED AT THE VIOLENCE, PEOPLE

HAD BEEN KILLED, THERE WOULD BE

PROMISES OF REFORM, AND THAT

ACTUALLY DID SLOWLY KIND OF MOVE

THINGS FORWARD TO THE POINT

WHERE WE REACHED IN THE

PROGRESSIVE ERA WHAT THEY CALLED

INDUSTRIAL DEMOCRACY, A FEELING

AMONGST GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS

THAT THERE MUST BE A BETTER WAY

TO DO THIS.

IT'S HURT PROGRESS DUCK

DIFFICULT AND PROFITS AND WE

DON'T WANT TO HAVE THIS KIND OF

LARGE GROUP OF UNRULY, ANGRY

PEOPLE IN OUR NATION'S CITIES.

>> RIGHT.

THAT'S GOTTEN US TO THE POINT

TODAY WHERE THE BIGGEST PROBLEM

IN THE WORKPLACE IS YOU'RE JUST

NOT SUPPOSED TO LOOK AT THAT

MUCH PORN.

[LAUGHTER]

HAVE THE UNIONS, THOUGH, THE

JOURNEY NOW, AND I IMAGINE THERE

IS ANOTHER MOVEMENT AFOOT, SO

THESE GROUPS THAT FOUGHT SO HARD

TO GAIN THE BASIC RESPECT AND

RIGHTS FOR THE WORKERS, HAVE

THEY THEMSELVES NOW BECOME SO

ENTRENCHED AND BLOATED THAT THEY

HAVE BECOME THE AGENTS OF

CORRUPTION?

>> WELL, I THINK TO A CERTAIN

EXTENT THAT'S BEEN ONE OF THE

PROBLEMS FOR UNIONS OVER THE

LAST HALF CENTURY OR SO.

THE PROBLEMS HAVE BEEN

SELF-MADE.

A LOT OF THE BIG UNIONS BEGAN TO

MIMIC BIG BUSINESS.

THEY HAD HUGE AMOUNTS OF MONEY

ON HAND.

THE LEADERS TENDED TO BE PEOPLE

WHO HAD NEVER ACTUALLY BEEN RANK

AND FILE, SO THERE WAS A

DISTANCE.

>>

>> Jon: AND THEY USE THE SAME

TYPE OF INTIMIDATION IN SOME

RESPECTS.

>> EXACTLY.

MANY OF THE LEADERS WERE

CHARISMATIC FIGURES WHO COULDN'T

BE QUESTIONED FROM BELOW.

ON THE OTHER HAND, EVEN THOUGH,

OF COURSE, A LOT OF THESE

CORRUPTION CASES ARE FAMOUS, I

THINK ONE HAS TO BE CAREFUL NOT

TO TAINT THE ENTIRE LABOR

MOVEMENT WITH THIS IDEA THAT

IT'S CORRUPT.

I THINK PEOPLE HOLD IT TO A

HIGHER STANDARD BECAUSE IT'S A

SOCIAL, ECONOMIC JUSTICE

MOVEMENT, BUT FOR EVERY HEADLINE

ABOUT CORRUPTION, THERE ARE

HUNDREDS OF LEGITIMATE LEGALLY

FUNCTIONING LOCAL UNIONS ACROSS

THE COUNTRY AND ALWAYS HAVE

BEEN.

>> WHERE DO YOU SEE THE VIBE SI

OF THE UNION MOVEMENT RIGHT NOW?

WHERE DO YOU THINK THE BEST WORK

IS BEING DONE, AND WHERE DO YOU

THINK THE MOST WORK NEEDS TO BE

DONE TO REIN IN THEIR POWER?

>> WELL, A COUPLE DIFFERENT

THINGS?

ONE, OF COURSE, IS THE LAST... I

THINK FOR MANY YEARS UNIONS WERE

KIND OF ASLEEP AT THE WHEEL.

I THINK THEY'VE COME ALIVE A

LITTLE BIT IN THE LAST

GENERATION OR SOME YOU SEE A LOT

OF ORGANIZING OF PEOPLE WHO HAD

NEVER REALLY BEEN ORGANIZED

BEFORE, JANITOR, HOSPITAL

WORKERS, JUST A COUPLE WEEKS AGO

OUT IN LOS ANGELES, THE CAR

WASH, 10,000 CAR WASH WORKERS

BEGAN TO ORGANIZE, SO YOU SEE

THAT IN AMERICA.

YOU ALSO SEE KIND OF AN ATTEMPT

FOR LABOR TO SORT OF GO GLOBAL

REALLY, IN OTHER WORDS, THAT'S

WHAT'S HAPPENING NOW WITH

GLOBALIZATION, BECAUSE JOBS HAVE

BEEN SENT OVERSEAS, LABOR HAS TO

FIND A WAY TO COORDINATE WORKERS

OVERSEAS.

AND THAT LABOR MOVEMENT, ONE

THAT INVOLVES HUMAN RIGHTS

GROUP, WOMEN RIGHTS GROUP,

ANTI-SWEATSHOP ORGANIZATIONS

INVOLVING CONSUMERS, THAT'S SORT

OF PICKING UP SPEED.

WE HAVE TO WAIT ANOTHER TEN OR

15 YEARS TO SEE IF THAT WILL

REALLY EVOLVE.

>> RIGHT.

AND IN TERMS OF THE AREAS WHERE

YOU THINK IT NEEDS REFORM, THE

ACTUAL UNION MOVEMENT ITSELF

NEEDS REFORM, WHERE DO YOU SEE

THAT?

>> WELL, I THINK YOU SEE THAT IN

A LOT OF UNIONS NOW BEING ASKED

FOR ACCOMMODATIONS OR PUSHBACK,

IN OTHER WORDS, TO KEEP

INSTITUTIONS OR COMPANIES VIABLE

>> Jon: HAVE THE UNIONS BEEN

GOOD PARTNERS TO THE AUTOMOTIVE

INDUSTRY, HAVE THEY BEEN GOOD

PARTNERS IN EDUCATION?

DO YOU FEEL LIKE THOSE UNIONS

HAVE BEEN GOOD PARTNERS?

>> THE UNITED AUTOWORKERS DID

GIVE A NUMBER OF THINGS BACK IN

TERMS OF PRIVILEGES AND BENEFITS

THEY HAD ACCRUED.

IT'S ALWAYS HARD TO GIVE UP

SOMETHING YOU FOUGHT FOR AND

WON.

THIS GOES BACK TO THE 1950s

WHEN THEY DECIDED THEY DIDN'T

NEED FIREMEN ON LOCOMOTIVES

ANYMORE.

THEY DIDN'T WANT THE LOSE THEIR

JOBS.

THEY WERE PROTECTED BY THE

UNION.

THERE'S BEEN VARIATIONS OF THAT

ALL ALONG.

NOW YOU HAVE THE TEACHERS UNION,

AS WELL, TRYING TO WORK WITH NEW

CHARTER SCHOOLS, TRYING TO FIND

A WAY TO ACCOMMODATE REFORM

WITHOUT JEOPARDIZING THEIR OWN

RANK AND FILE.

>> YOU WERE IN THE MUSICIANS

UNION.

>> YES.

>> Jon: APPARENTLY THERE WAS

AN INCIDENT.

>> THIS WAS MY INTRODUCTION TO

BEING A UNION MEMBER.

I WAS IN THE MINNEAPOLIS

MUSICIANS UNION MANY YEARS AGO.

AFTER HAVING TO SWEAR I WOULD

NEVER PLAY A MELATRON, AN

INSTRUMENT THAT COULD EMULATE

OTHER INSTRUMENTS AND TAKE

PEOPLE'S JOBS, THEY SAID, WE

HAVE TO STOP THE HARLEM

GLOBETROTTERS.

>> Jon:, YES, THE HARLEM

GLOBETROTTERS, THE MAN.

>> THE UNION WAS UPSET BECAUSE

THE GLOBETROTTERS WERE COMING TO

TOWN, BUT THEY DIDN'T WANT THE

HIRE AN EIGHT-PIECE ORCHESTRA.

THEY WANTED TO USE A TAPE

RECORDING OF "SWEET GEORGIA

BROWN," THEIR THEME SONG.

SO THE OLDER MEMBERS BEGAN

CALLING PEOPLE LIKE ME SAYING, I

NEED YOU ON THE PICKET LINE.

WE WERE INCLINED TO SAY, OF

COURSE THEY WANT TO USE A TAPE

RECORDER.

THAT MAKES PERFECT SENSE.

THAT WAS A GENERATIONAL SWITCH,

A DIFFERENT WAY OF LOOKING AT

THINGS.

I DON'T BELIEVE THEY EVER

STOPPED THE HARLEM

GLOBETROTTERS.

>> Jon: UNFORTUNATELY FIFE

PEOPLE DIED, BUT...

[LAUGHTER]

BUT IT IS, YOU KNOW, IT'S SO

IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE TO

REMEMBER, THOUGH, WHERE THE

MOVEMENT CAME FROM AND THE

STRUGGLE THAT IT DID JUST TO GET

PEOPLE THE BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS

THAT WORKERS SHOULD ENJOY.

IT'S A REALLY FASCINATING AND

GREAT STORY.

THANK YOU FOR WRITING THAT.

THERE IS POWER IN A UNION.

>> Jon: THAT'S OUR SHOW.

JOIN US TOMORROW NIGHT AT 11:00.

HERE IT IS, YOUR MOMENT OF ZEN.

>> OH, YES, I'LL BE THERE.

>> I'LL SEE YOU THERE.

>> I'LL BE THERE.

>> IF I'M NOT THERE, THEY'LL

START WITHOUT ME.

Loading...